Chris and Spyros are the founders of Men Of Style, the first self improvement company for Men in Greece, with a sole focus to help men enhance their relationship and communication skills and reach their true potential.
Men Of Style has been featured in all major media in Greece as an innovative implemented idea and a success story which thounsands so far, while at the same time successfully introduced the male self development industry in the Greek market!
They co authored the best selling book Andras Axias (Greek Title : Άνδρας Αξιας : Πώς να Βάλεις Τάξη στο Χάος του Σύγχρονου Φλερτ) and they are hosting Apla+Andrika, the first video podcast for men in Greece on YouTube and Spotify with thousands of followers in Greece and Cyprus!
[Podcast Transcript Using Artificial Intelligence]
Umar Hameed 0:01
Are you ready to become awesomer? Hello everyone. My name is Umar Hameed, I'm your host on the No Limits Selling podcast where industry leaders share their tips, strategies, and advice on how you can become better, stronger, faster. Just before we get started, I've got a question for you. Do you have a negative voice inside your head? We all do, right? I'm gonna help you remove that voice and under 30 days guaranteed not only remove it, but transform it. So instead of the voice that sabotages you, there's one that propels you to much higher levels of performance and success. There's a link in the show notes. Click on it to find out more. All right, let's get started.
Umar Hameed 0:41
Hey everyone, welcome to another episode of The No Limits Selling Podcast. Today we're here with Men of Style. And what this company does is something amazing, they teach Greek men how to flirt with women. So instead of going to a bar and feeling nervous and feeling like you're gonna die, you get to feel brave enough to go over to the prettiest woman in the bar and say, "Hello." The question I have for you is this, I'm not sure if you've noticed, but there are seven point something billion human beings on planet Earth, men and women have been meeting for a very long time and reproducing, but yet, when I see a pretty girl across the bar,
Men of Style 1:24
Umar Hameed 1:25
It's difficult, right? This is the problem that you guys solve. Welcome to the show.
Men of Style 1:30
Thank you for having us. It's a privilege invitation, thank you very much. As I said earlier, said, this is our first in the national interview. We had one earlier with a Greek-Canadian, that was in Greek, so it doesn't count.
Umar Hameed 1:47
And I happen to be Canadian.
Men of Style 1:49
Umar Hameed 1:50
Men of Style 1:50
Umar Hameed 1:51
You guys can only go to Canada, that's it.
Men of Style 1:53
Okay. So the thing is that, yes, all these people try and meet and flirt with each other. But the truth is that men still have this approach anxiety. They don't want to feel this pain of approaching another human being.
Umar Hameed 2:12
Men of Style 2:12
Because there is a fear of...
Umar Hameed 2:14
Men of Style 2:15
And the fear of exposure, you know,
Umar Hameed 2:18
Men of Style 2:19
And then, fear of not knowing what to say.
Umar Hameed 2:23
Umar Hameed 2:23
It's a, and what the Men of Style does is since 2014, they've been helping Greek men meet women,
Men of Style 2:32
Umar Hameed 2:32
It's the most, it's the most natural thing in the world to do. But yet, it's difficult and when we were chatting before this interview, about a week ago, I was mentioning that, you know, if someone goes to a bar, and they see a woman that they go, "Whoa, I'd like to be your friend," they can go that can be magnificent, strong, powerful, charming, laughing. But if the thought changes to, "I want to have sex with her, or I want to date her," then all of a sudden, it's the rules change and the behavior changes.
Men of Style 3:02
Because it's the difference, is the difference between the perception of value between the two of them. Because when I have want to have a social conversation with you, it's very simple because there are no consequences.
Umar Hameed 3:17
Men of Style 3:17
Okay. But at the second level, when I want to be the lover, then I have to prove myself,
Umar Hameed 3:27
That I'm worthy.
Men of Style 3:27
That I'm worthy. Because it's evolutionary the biological need this process over millions of years, millions of years. So it's not so simple, it's very complicated but sometimes we can make it easy. Because the core of this concept is that, what are your choices, okay? Let's see that from this point of view.
Umar Hameed 3:57
What are your choices, yes.
Men of Style 3:59
Umar Hameed 3:59
What are the choices?
Men of Style 4:00
You have one choice, okay? The first choice is to approach the woman and say, "What do you want?"
Umar Hameed 4:04
Men of Style 4:05
Where sometimes, it's not so simple, because, what do you want?
Umar Hameed 4:11
Well, that's a good question.
Men of Style 4:12
What do you want?
Umar Hameed 4:14
We'll come back to that, yes.
Men of Style 4:15
We want the woman wo know about you and what do you want to learn from here, okay? That's the first choice. The second choice is loneliness. So we evaluate the profit and the cost, always, because in every move, were taking we are doing in our life, there is risk. So we have to evaluate the risk, but there is always risk in our choices and consequences.
Umar Hameed 4:45
So let's break that down a little bit.
Men of Style 4:47
Umar Hameed 4:48
So this sounds like a binary choice, do or not do, but it's a it's more than that, right? I can come and say, "Hi, I'm really scared right now,
Men of Style 4:59
Umar Hameed 4:59
...to meet you"
Men of Style 5:00
Umar Hameed 5:00
And there is a level of authenticity and vulnerability, in which case, the lady can say, "Get out of here," or more than likely is going to go, "Hey, don't worry, let me say hello," or you can show I'm going to be ego and I'm going to be bigger than life. So it's show or don't show, and when you show, how do you show? Do you show your real self or do you go, you know, "I want to be like, Spyros, I want to be cool like that when I show up?" I don't know,
Men of Style 5:27
It's not so easy to be like Spyros...
Umar Hameed 5:29
Men of Style 5:29
Men of Style 5:30
Men of Style 5:31
The thing is that you don't have to be someone else. We have to be yourself, but what you said earlier, that, "Hello, I'm really shy right now,
Umar Hameed 5:42
Men of Style 5:42
is a great opener. You can start the conversation with that, because you're showing your real self and it's sincere and open. And people really like this sometimes.
Umar Hameed 5:51
I think part of the problem is this is that most people do not know who they are. It's like, "Umar," so that sounds crazy, of course, I know I am, "I'm Umar Hameed, I'm over here," but the reality is no. We have an illusion of who we are, and I think the reason the Great's in history, whether it was Buddha, or whoever is, they had to take a, like Buddha's like he's wandering around and then he finally goes to sit under the Tree of Enlightenment and what he said was, "It's hard to find God. If God wants me to find him, He should come to me," and that wasn't really what happened. It was like the self realization of who I am, was the key to getting connection.
Men of Style 6:32
I'm glad you're suffering.
Umar Hameed 6:33
Yeah. And so I think what the problem is that most people have a, "This is what a leader should do. This is what a good man should do," and all of that is bullshit. What it needs to be is, "This is who I am. This is my purpose in life. This is why I'm here on planet Earth, I think is a human right that most people do not know. Knowing who I am, in terms of my values around work around love around." The person I want you to love most in the world, is me... No, the most person I want you to love most of the world is yourself, right? If you can do that most people do not love themselves. And it's like they were astounded that other people find them lovable. I think if a leader can do that, then they come at it from a place of authenticity.
Men of Style 7:16
And it's very difficult. Because a simple question. Okay, you want to be happy? Of course, I want to be happy. Yeah. Okay. How are we going to do that? Tell me what makes you happy?
Umar Hameed 7:27
Men of Style 7:28
And the most things that make us happy, we have them already. And this is the hard part of realization about happiness. Because what do we think that brings us happy is about money or it's about recognition. Because it's very difficult to know what makes you happy. Because in order to find what makes you happy, you have to feel pain. Because you have to make yourself uncomfortable.
Umar Hameed 8:01
I think there's a quote from Pablo Picasso, it says, you know, "If it wasn't for the night, you would not see the stars."
Men of Style 8:07
Of course, of course. But if you are not make yourself uncomfortable, to feel the pain and make the changes to make your life better, then you will think that the things that will make you happy are the things that you are seeing the other people make them happy.
Umar Hameed 8:31
As soon as I get my Tesla I'll be happy.
Men of Style 8:34
Umar Hameed 8:34
For one month.
Men of Style 8:35
Umar Hameed 8:36
and then I will go back to, yes.
Men of Style 8:37
my Ferrari, my Bugatti, my great house, but you know, these are things and you have the Hedonic Treadmill from the psychology, part psychological part that is saying that, okay, "Everything that you will ever have about the things I have cars, houses, okay, jewels. It will be boring for you."
Umar Hameed 9:07
There's a connection there. And I think, at least in my worldview, we each have three faces. Face number one is the face I want to show the rest of the world. And so when I'm with my friends, is like, "Hey, I'm one of you. I'm a cool guy." And, but the second face is, "Who I think I am," I show people I'm a cool guy, but inside it's like a lonely or shy or broken. And then we have the third space, which is who we truly deeply are. I think very few people show up in life, exactly who they are. And these people are the people that people want to be around because you feel safe. Because you know lots of people in your personal life that when you look at them, and you look at who they try to pretend to be there's a difference.
Men of Style 9:56
I totally get it but is there a fourth path? I mean,
Umar Hameed 10:00
Please tell us.
Men of Style 10:01
Maybe there's a guy that you're trying to be. Let's say that, because we think that flirting is a way of evolving, a way, a way of self-development, because when you're trying to attract people, you are showing your best self and maybe you find out that some qualities of yours need to be improved.
Umar Hameed 10:21
Men of Style 10:22
And then you become someone else that attracts these kind of people.
Umar Hameed 10:26
Absolutely, I think you need skills. And that's what your company is all about is flirting and how to connect with people and how to be attractive to the, to someone you want to find you attractive.
Men of Style 10:39
And opportunity to reconstruct yourself.
Umar Hameed 10:43
Men of Style 10:43
Because we have and one face more. Okay. You said three?
Umar Hameed 10:49
Oh, he said four now we got the fifth which was,
Men of Style 10:51
The fifth, okay.
Umar Hameed 10:52
Men of Style 10:52
And the fifth one is that all, all of us will have some insecurities. Okay, that we don't know, if we are enough. And you don't, if you don't know, your self-worth, then you are try to make the others give you...
Umar Hameed 11:13
Men of Style 11:14
...validation so that you can say, "Okay, I'm enough." So it's the face that we want the others to perceive us?
Umar Hameed 11:24
Men of Style 11:25
And this is very complicated, because it's about the persona. We have a need and we think that we must show a kind of value that show that the others accept us. It's about the self-acceptance, acceptance and how the others accept us.
Umar Hameed 11:43
Men of Style 11:44
And to add to that, as Christos says many times, when you get rejected vicious securities get validated.
Umar Hameed 11:52
Absolutely. And you know, what happens when people accept us and we don't feel worthy of the acceptance? We tell our friends, "I don't believe it,"
Men of Style 12:02
Umar Hameed 12:02
like she, and what we're really doing is literally we don't speak accidentally. We speak the truth all the time. We just don't realize it, we think it's a figure of speech. But we reveal so much by the words we use.
Men of Style 12:14
There are guys married to women for a year, and they still don't believe it. They woke up with with this beautiful woman, and then beside them, and they don't believe it because they have this imposter syndrome, you know, imposter syndrome.
Umar Hameed 12:27
Yes. imposter syndrome.
Men of Style 12:28
Yeah, that's a really, really bad.
Umar Hameed 12:31
What's really shocking is, I meet a lot of people, let's say there's a group of 100 people, I would say, a certain percentage of them will feel unworthy of love, like, I'm not worthy to be loved. And that breaks my heart when I see that. And when a baby is born, it is completely helpless. And very, very quickly, it can get its father, in America, we say, "wrapped around the finger," when it becomes a one or two, it's like, I control this man, he's mine. And then we go from that power of being ourselves authentically, to growing up second guessing ourselves and doubting ourselves.
Men of Style 13:15
You know why? Because when there is a relationship between a father, a mother and a child, there is this unconditional love, okay, but when it comes to flirting or dating, then love becomes an exchange of value. We have something to offer, and you ask for something but,
Umar Hameed 13:36
I think this is true for parent-child relationship as well.
Men of Style 13:40
Why do you say?
Umar Hameed 13:42
Men of Style 13:43
I do not disagree, but...
Umar Hameed 13:45
So why I say that is this is that our parents want to keep us alive.
Men of Style 13:50
Umar Hameed 13:51
And many things are safe in this world. If I am six months old, this is life threatening, I can eat, I can choke. When I put this in my mouth, my parents are happy. Soon as I do this, my parents don't say put that down. They go into fight or flight response, because they think the most valuable thing in the entire world is about to die.
Men of Style 14:15
Yes, but why?
Umar Hameed 14:16
They go, "No, stop dirty!" As soon as they do that that baby does not think its actions is bad as dirty, it thinks it is bad. And this is how we create our comfort zone. Our parents love is to keep us alive and they use this is what they use to control us. They use fear, don't talk to strangers. They use guilt, this is anger towards oneself. We do something bad that the parents like they do it for our best interest, then we feel guilty. We feel lack of self-worth. And our parents this was not their intention, their intention is to keep us alive and make us flourish. But those things create the comfort zone and the comfort zone is the enemy, because if we're not expanding the comfort zone, it is shrinking. And this is where you come in, men reach out to you and say, "I don't want to be lonely. I want to meet someone of my dreams, helped me."
Men of Style 15:15
Yeah, it's about individualization process.
Umar Hameed 15:18
Men of Style 15:19
And I think it's about maturity. That's a very complicated thing because come on, man, you can't be successful in your business. And then, then you're going to speak to a woman and you're terrified. Something's wrong, something we must fix.
Umar Hameed 15:38
Yes, it's, we have different rules for different circumstances. So what like we talked about being friends with someone,
Men of Style 15:45
Umar Hameed 15:46
The rules are, "Hey, I can be myself. They're a person, I'm a person, we're gonna have a great conversation."
Men of Style 15:52
Umar Hameed 15:52
But soon as it's I want to date her different rules come in, and I behave differently.
Men of Style 15:56
Umar Hameed 15:57
And so if we can just say, "No, no," I'll give you a good example, this is really a sales podcast, I promise, we're going to talk about sales in a minute, is sometimes I have someone make some cold calls,
Men of Style 16:10
Umar Hameed 16:11
and you make some cold calls and what I do is I record you making your cold calls. And then I say, "Christos, do me a favor, call your best friend, invite them out to the movies this weekend," and you, I record you and then I playback both recordings. The second phone call with your friend, you have a rich, friendly, engaging voice. When you were talking to customers, it's like tight and rigid. And so how do we, this is what you do, so people are calling you and they call, they see an ad on Facebook, they call so you train your staff to answer that phone call, how do you train them?
Men of Style 16:50
So first of all, let me get you through the process a little bit,
Umar Hameed 16:53
Men of Style 16:53
because we don't do cold calls. Why? Because,
Umar Hameed 16:56
Men of Style 16:56
we totally believe that the person that comes here not to be trained, has to be really dedicated and really open to this, so it must be his decision, not the sales pitch, okay?
Umar Hameed 17:10
Men of Style 17:11
So yes, we do some Facebook Ads or Google ads,
Umar Hameed 17:15
Men of Style 17:15
and we have a strong social media presence. And when they see our videos, or our articles, posts, online, etc, they reach out to us. So they may ask something about their relationship, they may ask something about their fears, or their, let's say how to approach a woman or the woman I like, especially a woman. So the team that research is responsible for call them back. And then they go through a mini-interview, let's say, to see if there is something, a program an educational material that we can produce for him, in order for him to be trained with us.
Umar Hameed 17:56
Men of Style 17:57
But the first, the first goal, it's to really understand their needs.
Umar Hameed 18:04
Men of Style 18:05
Because sometimes, I'm not hearing your voice, I'm hearing my thoughts. And that's wrong.
Umar Hameed 18:13
So how do you? How do you create empathy in your sales team? Because to really hear someone you need to have empathy and really hear, and because it's so easy to go, "Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah," then I'll say something it but it takes conscious effort to pay attention. So how do you train your people to be, to connect because people on the other end of the phone can sense this immediately? When someone's listening to me versus,
Men of Style 18:38
There are two basic rules, okay. The first rule is that you are not calling a stranger, you're, you're calling a person that you know him, you like him, but you don't know what he's doing in his life for the past six months old,
Umar Hameed 18:56
High school friends, now you don't know what's going on? Yes.
Men of Style 18:59
this is the first rule. The second rule is you are not calling the other person to make a cell. You're calling him to know if you can help him change his life for the better.
Umar Hameed 19:16
Brilliant. So two very important things here because people can sense this. One, I'm just gonna re, reinstate is very much, is like, you know, "Hey, this is a friend to be," and two, just really listening to what the issue is for that person. Because it's so easy to, we do it all the time. We judge people in terms of all you must need this.
Men of Style 19:38
Umar Hameed 19:39
And so this we need to avoid and, and get the person to say, "This is what's going on." So how do you, do you get people to reaccess their emotions when they went to meet someone because sometimes they met that person and sometimes they wanted to, but they felt so uncomfortable, they did not. Do you get people to go back to that moment, your customers to really re-experience the discomfort of it?
Men of Style 20:07
Something that we are doing with the person that we're calling, it's that we are trying to understand. And I'll make it a with a simple explanation that the needs or the needs that he has is multi-level,
Umar Hameed 20:23
Men of Style 20:24
yeah. And the salesperson must understand that and the other person must understand that. For example, you want to find a beautiful woman, a quality woman that you want maybe to make a relationship with?
Umar Hameed 20:42
Men of Style 20:43
Okay, that's a need, okay. But maybe, we have at the opposite side another need. You don't have time, because you are a workaholic?
Umar Hameed 20:57
Men of Style 20:58
These are two needs and we must find a solution. Because if you want to become better at dating, okay. And you're saying at the same time, that you don't have time, we have a problem. But I can't, I can't communicate that with you because it's wrong, it's a very bad communication, like, I can't say to you, okay, you want to become better with dating, but you don't have, the you don't have time, okay, goodbye.
Umar Hameed 21:31
True. But sometimes, I feel uncomfortable dating or approaching women. And so what I do is I focus on work and this gives me the excuse. The reason I can't do this is because I'm working all the time and the reason we're working all the time is to avoid the pain. So sometimes these things are aligned, but the client is not aware of it. So if your salespeople can give them the enlightenment of, "Holy shit, wait a minute," I had no idea because I think this is where we build connection is by asking questions. What we're trying to do is this, is not only understand, but if I can give my clients the Epiphany, then I build trust, and I make their life better just in that conversation.
Men of Style 22:17
You can also add here that we tried to hire people that previously were our students. They were here and they were experiencing the same needs and pains.
Umar Hameed 22:27
Men of Style 22:28
So when they tried to discover the needs of our, of our new customer, it's easier for them.
Umar Hameed 22:33
Absolutely. So you're in the business of love.
Men of Style 22:38
Umar Hameed 22:39
Which hopefully it will lust then lust maybe love if you're like.
Men of Style 22:42
Umar Hameed 22:43
Men of Style 22:44
What law comes later.
Umar Hameed 22:46
Absolutely. So for your salespeople, you have some sales people that are motivated by money. Some people have motivated by recognition, some people are motivated by something else. How do you diagnose your salespeople? Because you cannot do same thing for everybody, so to manage them, how do you uncover what their motivations are? And how do you help them reach their potential?
Men of Style 23:13
Every one of them has their own motivation, with one way or another, they want a better life. The (Garbled) that will do that, maybe it will be with recognition with money, and it's okay with, but they have to understand by me or by Spyros that the most important motivation is that you can provide a service that really change lives. And that's the number one motivation for a company.
Umar Hameed 23:52
That makes perfect sense.
Men of Style 23:53
Umar Hameed 23:55
Men of Style 23:57
Okay. Nice please.
Umar Hameed 24:01
Somebody may not have, so you can buy, you can get clothes. Or you can get people that come together for, for a common cause, "We want to make this company great because we help Greeks get more happiness." But the individual motivations may not be the helping it may be the different things. So how do you balance the two because I know you want to, as a company you have this is what we're about, but human beings are human beings.
Men of Style 24:32
Umar Hameed 24:33
So how do you balance the two? How do you been balanced the individual as well as the company doctrine?
Men of Style 24:39
There is no secret sauce to this. We talk to this people everyday.
Umar Hameed 24:44
Your salespeople everyday.
Men of Style 24:45
Yes, of course, because need sales. Let's say our account manager, Angeliki, who is a great salesperson.
Umar Hameed 24:53
Men of Style 24:55
At first, it was all about money, but now she has two kids,
Umar Hameed 24:59
Men of Style 25:00
And money play an important role in your life. So, when it comes to Angeliki, we can say that money is very important motivation. But not only that, as Christos earlier said, when it comes to her job, she's paid very well, and also creates a new future for some customers.
Umar Hameed 25:23
Men of Style 25:24
And that's a great motivator.
Men of Style 25:27
And one more is the, sorry, is the environment.
Umar Hameed 25:31
Men of Style 25:32
A company's environment.
Umar Hameed 25:33
Men of Style 25:34
Okay. We must have a bubble of respect of responsibility because if things don't go well, which will happen, you must know that I will not insult you, I will not judge you, but I will speak with you with respectful way to find the solution to make it better.
Umar Hameed 25:58
Men of Style 25:58
Because this is what a leader does, makes his people better.
Umar Hameed 26:07
That is the ideal, for sure. So going back to money. So it turns out that money is very, very important to many, many salespeople. But the research shows that money is incredibly important. I feel like I have to make a step to till you reach your threshold of looking after all your responsibilities.
Men of Style 26:27
Umar Hameed 26:28
Then after that, for most people money loses his power,
Men of Style 26:31
Umar Hameed 26:31
And then other things take over.
Men of Style 26:33
Umar Hameed 26:34
And so you know, when you were earning this much, and no kids, it's okay. But when you have two kids, then it's like, "Okay, we need to increase." What is the culture of Men of Style? What would be the behaviors and the attitude that people have? (Garbled) ask you, and then last Spyros, how would you describe the culture of this company?
Men of Style 26:56
Umar Hameed 26:57
Men of Style 26:58
Umar Hameed 26:59
What does that mean in English? Or Greek?
Men of Style 27:01
Yeah, the most important person in the company is our customers. And this is the number one.
Umar Hameed 27:10
So let me pause you right there for a second...
Men of Style 27:12
Umar Hameed 27:12
...because this isn't ideal. And if we go to America, or Canada, they will be at least 50 million or 100 million companies that will say the exact same fucking thing, but they will not mean it. So how do you guys mean it? How do you guys make it real? Because it sounds wonderful, but give me an example of some of your people living and breathing this?
Men of Style 27:39
Yeah. It's very simple. Okay. You're my customer?
Umar Hameed 27:43
Men of Style 27:44
And you are taking a service for me? three to six months, months. After you finish the service?
Umar Hameed 27:52
Men of Style 27:52
Okay. I will change your life.
Umar Hameed 27:56
That's a good question.
Men of Style 27:57
Is your life better? Okay. I have the (Garbled). That's it. That's so simple. Three months later,
Umar Hameed 28:07
Men of Style 28:07
After we are finished, our cooperation, okay. Is your life better? Show me the results, because it's very, very important.
Umar Hameed 28:17
Let me ask it this way, because I think that's a really good measure.
Men of Style 28:20
Umar Hameed 28:21
So let's say, in America, they have this store called Walgreens, they' re a pharmacy. And they have decided to measure the profitability per shopping bag, "How can we make the shopping bag more profitable?" And so for the people in the buying department, they have to buy the right products that customers want, that are profitable enough to make more profit increase in the bag. The advertising people have to advertise, to get customers into the store to do that, they train this staff to do that. So every department can connect what they're doing to the profitability of the shopping bag, and also, did we improve what we're doing, let's say you've got your digital presence, social media presence. So how do you tie behaviors of your employees to that goal, which I think is a brilliant goal, but sometimes people feel disconnected from that, depending on the job.
Men of Style 29:21
Well first of all, we're totally human centric company.
Umar Hameed 29:26
Men of Style 29:27
So when it comes to our customers, the thing is that if we, if they are not happy with the service, we don't stop till they're happy, that's our main goal. And all our people in this place are, let's say, educated to feel and back the same way. Okay?
Umar Hameed 29:46
Absolutely. I think your, your results that you measure all the time is a very, very high level of satisfaction at three months or six months. So you guys live it, breathe it. I'm just trying to decode it for our viewers that you know, I understand that but how do you actually do, and you're explaining now. So thank you for that.
Men of Style 30:06
Yes, we are a, we contact them all the time, we're beside them. First of all, when they are in the process of the training thing, the training procedure, we go out with them, with lead people with them.
Umar Hameed 30:22
So you go out there. So just before we go further, what's the name of your receptionists?
Men of Style 30:27
Maria and Helen.
Umar Hameed 30:29
And who's upstairs now?
Men of Style 30:30
Umar Hameed 30:30
Maria. So when I, this is the second time I've come into this company, and just that one person alone, welcoming, warm, make me feel, made me feel really special. And so she's living and breathing what you're talking about?
Men of Style 30:46
Please, let me give you a backstory.
Umar Hameed 30:47
Men of Style 30:48
Some backstory, because I think it's crucial for the viewers to, before creating Men of Style, before founding Men of Style, we were, let's say professionals that we already had some careers. We're happy with our careers.
Umar Hameed 31:03
Men of Style 31:03
But we left all that all this behind in order to create an environment and a company that's totally human centric, as I said earlier. That means that when I go to my company, when I go to my office, I really like it. And I want people there to work with me. that I really like, and they like me back. A little bit, let's say,
Umar Hameed 31:21
Men of Style 31:22
but they like me back, that is a main goal for our management team, okay? We want people here that are okay to work with that are happy to work with us.
Umar Hameed 31:33
So a lot of,
Men of Style 31:34
That's why you're seeing Maria and Helen, and they are very polite, they're very warm, welcoming,
Umar Hameed 31:39
Genuine from the heart.
Men of Style 31:41
Yeah. And one more thing, okay. It's very important. At the sales process to decode to decode the expectations of the other person, the customer?
Umar Hameed 31:56
Men of Style 31:56
Yeah. You have to know their expectations, because you have to know if you can meet them.
Umar Hameed 32:03
Men of Style 32:06
If you can't meet them, you can't help them.
Umar Hameed 32:09
Men of Style 32:10
And we always promise less when we can deliver is, so it comes with a sense of over delivering. Yes.
Umar Hameed 32:17
Nice. So before we part company today, you're the CEO of the company, what is one piece of advice you can give other leaders and leaders of sales teams to get better performance out of their people?
Men of Style 32:34
From my point of view, if they have a sales team, they have to evaluate if the sales team succeed with a very important goal how is the psychology after?
Umar Hameed 32:49
Give me an example of what you mean?
Men of Style 32:51
Okay. Yes, they are celebrating for the company, that they succeed the goal or they are saying, "Yeah, okay, at least we succeed."
Umar Hameed 33:04
What's the difference between the two for you?
Men of Style 33:06
Because I don't want and this very difficult in the leadership area,
Umar Hameed 33:14
Men of Style 33:15
but they don't want, I don't want to succeed, and to reach the goal for me. That I want to reach the goal for the team, for the people, for the manager for the, for the company. And this is I think the successful leadership.
Umar Hameed 33:35
Agreed, you and I wouldn't be on the same page.
Men of Style 33:38
I don't want to say that, "Okay. Okay. I succeed, I reach the goal, okay. Get the fuck out of here, Okay?"
Umar Hameed 33:46
Men of Style 33:46
"Get out of here goal because it goes very pressure. It has a lot of pressure. It was devastating for me. Oh, my God, because I have one more goal to reach. Come on, man." The life is its goals. It's nothing more nothing else. Because you have to know where you're going, and that's the leader, that's the role of the real leader.
Men of Style 33:46
You think a leader has three responsibilities. Number one is having a compelling vision that other people fall in love with and go, "I want to be part of that." Number two is the culture.
Men of Style 34:28
Umar Hameed 34:30
How do people behave in the company? Is it selfish, which is biologically driven, I'm biologically hardwired to be selfish. And the only reason I'll stop being selfish is if you can create a vision that allows me to go beyond myself. Hence, when you were talking about, "What is the goal for the company?" people can celebrate and go after that. When it's about my ego, then it's different because when you leave the company, the company's value goes down. When you create it about the culture, the company, then you can leave and go on vacation for two years, the company still runs just as well. And the third thing is long term shareholder value, how to make this more valuable? So for you Spyros, what is one advice you would give people because you tend to be, if I can be so bold, that Christos is very much the results,
Men of Style 35:24
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Umar Hameed 35:24
data, and you are like the heart.
Men of Style 35:29
Thank you. So the thing is that,
Umar Hameed 35:31
Both is like very important.
Men of Style 35:32
Yes, of course, I would say that revenue is just the fuel in order to go on and follow what your heart really wants to follow. Because if we measure profits, and revenue all the time, and we have these metrics are as, let's say, the end goal, then we lose our main focus, which is customer satisfaction. And I believe that this is the main factor that drove our success. If we can say that we have some success in our area, we do not measure revenue, as hard as other people measure it. So it worked for us, maybe it would work for you too.
Umar Hameed 36:17
Brilliant. So I've been asking a lot of questions. Questions for me?
Men of Style 36:24
Of course, one. One, only one.
Umar Hameed 36:28
Men of Style 36:28
I have two, three, or five most important, life lessons.
Umar Hameed 36:36
I think useful lies are incredibly important. So I will tell you one useful lie that I believe that God lives here, He lives there, He lives in you, in you. It is my job to see the God in you. When I have fear, when I have doubt what I don't love myself, it is very hard to see love in someone else. If Mother Teresa was alive, maybe I can see love with him within her easily. But when I think of somebody who is a fucking asshole, that that person has God within them. And when I become higher in my evolution as a human being, I can see love in that person as well. So I think that would be two things there. One, there's no such thing as truth, or reality, it is just a fiction. Number two, God lives within all of us. And if we could see that. So when your salespeople are talking to that person on the phone, that is being challenging, or is afraid, if we saw God in them that we would just treat them differently. So there'd be two and I'll give you one last third one, this may be a Bible quote, but is, "There is no good, there is no evil," it's what meaning we give to it. So money in our society, there's lots of negative thoughts around money. Money is money. It's who we are. So I'll give you the fifth one. The Talmud has this one quote, which I think is the most amazing is, "We do not see the universe as it is, we see the universe as we are." So I think I said the same thing five ways.
Men of Style 38:31
I have one question. So let's say that you're meeting with our Maker,
Umar Hameed 38:38
Men of Style 38:39
God. And He goes, "Umar, you've been a great, great person. And to thank you for being such a great person, I will grant you one wish. I will change everything you want in this world in in whatever, whatever you want. Can you state one thing that you would like to change globally wide?
Umar Hameed 39:06
Right now when we meet people, it's who I am as occupation, I'm a Greek, I'm a Canadian, I'm a this. If we could change the world, and the one thing is that I saw you as a human being first, we all saw each other as a human being first. And then we said, "Oh," and I happen to do these other things as well that I think would change the world. The truth sometimes lies in the extremes. It's always here that we could see but it's hard to see but when you go to the extremes is very clear to see. The most extreme communication relationship is between the person who tortures people and the victim. We train our soldiers that if you get captured by the enemy, this person is going to torture you and do the most horrible things on the planet. Your survival depends on seeing the humanity in that person, because if you can relate with them as a human being, they will see you as a human being, and they will stop doing these bad things. And we train our people that torture people, that you need to see this person as a thing or a number. If you see that person as a human being, that you cannot do your job effectively. And so I think communications is all about seeing the humanity and the other person. And it's so easy to overlook when his day to day life and I think that's the most precious. And that's what you spoke about earlier today was with your salespeople, see the human being on the other side of the when you spoke about leading people, see the human being in that. And I think that at the end of the world, at the end of the day is what it's all about. Gentlemen, thank you so much for being on the show. It's been a privilege and I didn't have to do any hard work, you've got these talented people here in your studio. And best of luck to you.
Men of Style 40:54
Thank you, you too. Please enjoy your stay in Athens and in Greece in general, you're going to Santorini tomorrow, right?
Umar Hameed 41:00
Yes, Santorini will be beautiful.
Men of Style 41:02
I would agree. Enjoy the beautiful sands of Santorini. And please come back to us.
Umar Hameed 41:07
Men of Style 41:08
Thank you very much.
Umar Hameed 41:14
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